For all you "Lubrication Engineers"!!!!!
www.petersoncat.com/sites/cat/files/downloads/Cat%20TDTO.pdf

"ccjersey" wrote:

How do automatic transmissions survive when filled with ATF? By Rome’s logic we should be using 30 weight motor oil in all automatic and power shift transmissions. We don’t, we use transmission fluids. The key difference between a transmission fluid and a motor oil is the additive package used in the fluid. Transmission fluid has both extreme pressure lubricants to prevent wear and friction modifiers that make brakes and clutches operate smoothly without slipping.

The Caterpillar pony motor gear train/pinion clutch compartment is NOT an engine crankcase, it’s more of a transmission/wet clutch/brake application. It doesn’t need the additive package of a motor oil and operates properly when filled with a transmission oil. If you don’t like the idea of ATF, use a TO rated fluid instead.

I was referring to the starting engine clutch housing ONLY! NOT automatic transmissions!

"Neil" wrote:

Hi greengiant, did you get some helpful feedback from this thread? As you can see, lubrication is a contentious topic : )

Yes I certainly did and I was just going to thank everyone. I always enjoy the lubrication discussions and learn something every time.
My D2 pinion grinds in or won't engage at all when the motor is running so I will try the Dexron in it for now. My other ponies work fine so I will use motor oil in them, the 10-30 that I use in their crank cases.
this made me go around check levels and sure enough they were all low, likewise the fuel injection pump housings. I just don't think to check them as religiously as the crank cases.

Thanks everyone!

It also helps to idle the pony down slow before trying to engage the pinion. Some won’t idle well, so it becomes a grind it in type of process. A good starting pony will start with the pinion latched in but they’re rare in my experience.

The whole problem is the drag of the oil between the bronze and steel pinion clutch disks. This same thing happens on oil type main clutches. I had never had it happen to me until one day I started up my 9U D6 in the shop on the concrete floor. When the main engine started the tractor lurched forward about a foot before stopping. I was forceably reminded that the starting procedure is to have transmission in neutral and brake locked!

I latch the starter pinion in before starting my pony. If the pinion gear doesn't quite mesh with the flywheel ring gear then all I have to do is rotate the pony flywheel by hand a little bit to get the proper gear meshing. No need to grind it in then if your clutch brake doesn't brake well.

However, it doesn't help if your pinion pops out before the diesel starts. Then you probably are needing it to grind in.

As far as proper lubrication, I think you probably are fine using ATF or the book recommended oil. I get the feeling that as long as there is some lubricant in there that is reasonable to use that it should be fine and probably outlast any other part of the tractor if you didn't use the book recommended oil. I don't think many people have had the starting engine clutch and pinon assembly as something that is a major problem if you use the "wrong" oil in it.

"BigAgCat" wrote:

I latch the starter pinion in before starting my pony. If the pinion gear doesn't quite mesh with the flywheel ring gear then all I have to do is rotate the pony flywheel by hand a little bit to get the proper gear meshing. No need to grind it in then if your clutch brake doesn't brake well.

However, it doesn't help if your pinion pops out before the diesel starts. Then you probably are needing it to grind in.

As far as proper lubrication, I think you probably are fine using ATF or the book recommended oil. I get the feeling that as long as there is some lubricant in there that is reasonable to use that it should be fine and probably outlast any other part of the tractor if you didn't use the book recommended oil. I don't think many people have had the starting engine clutch and pinon assembly as something that is a major problem if you use the "wrong" oil in it.

+1 as long as you give the pony time to heat the main engine properly.